...for having the guts to stand up and take a penalty. Nicolas Anelka - hang your head. 7th penalty? You soft git.
What a great final it was. Not a free flowing footballing spectacle but it was fantastic to watch. However, the penalty shootout was the most agonizing viewing to come out of Moscow since Police Academy 7.
Justice was about to be served up on a plate after Ronaldo's smug grin was wiped following his joke effort. But sadly, the pitch gods were smiling on Manchester United as the mighty John Terry's foot was taken out from under him as he sent Van De Sar the wrong way. Although we'll never know, it looked like the penalty would have gone in if it wasn't for that slice of bad luck.
Oh well. In better news, Anthony Quinn crossed first for New South Wales in the first State of Origin game winning me the massive $6 sweepstake pot. Get in there.
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3 comments:
First off, I'll at least give you bonus points for not calling Chelsea "Chelski"
Secondly, come on Gartside, you can do better than this.
Saying you would back Chelsea in a final for a list of reasons that you could have easily interchanged the words "Chelsea" and "United" (or "ManUre" maybe) and been on the other side of the fence?
1a. Just wondering, what are you views on the legions of fans of clubs over the years who pay their paymaster chairmen then spend a match chanting "Ellis Out"/"Bates Out" etc etc etc? Who's stupid - those who refuse to pay them or those that carry on paying them, in turn justifying the position of their antagonist?
And for that matter, what about the loyal supporters of various teams that boo off their players at half time or full time? I'm thinking specifically of recent time England supporters. Why go?
1b. Not just a natural by produce of a decade of domination. A Natural by product of "stand up if you hate Man U" at various premier league grounds and at England matches. Villification of Gary/Philip Neville for mistakes. The treatment of Beckham post-98.
"I don't like the success of my current team so I'll watch England as well. And support both" is the phrase that springs to mind for most of the burberry clad knuckle draggers
And what's wrong with Tevez and an Argentinian flag? I'm no nationalist myself, but last time I checked he was Argentinian. Why is it so bad he's wearing that flag? Is it because of a limited skirmish 26 years ago, before he was even born? Heaven forbid England waved any St George crosses at Germany 2006 - oh hang on, they did.
1c. And why not? It's his perogative. He doesn't have to speak to the press if he doesn't want to. Any ill-conceived notion that it's his duty to is quite frankly bollocks.
2. Two words: Alan Shearer (in fact, have five: Alan Shearer stinks of p!ss). A great talent no doubt, but the man made a career of leaning on people, falling over then and whinging to the refereee - (and, of course, scorer of many goals, so credit where credit is due. Only two people have scored 31 goals in a 38 game premiership so fair play to him).
Although we'll never know, had chelsea scored more goals than united than they probably would've won.
I can do better than what? Giving my personal opinion? My reasons for backing Chelsea were a) because our football team plays in Chelsea kits and b) they are the lesser of two evils in my eyes (a phrase I probably should have used to better describe it).
The list I gave were reasons for re-igniting my ABU feelings.
1a. I'll cite Oldham as a recent example. 3 or 4 years ago we had Ronnie Moore as our manager. He came in and saved us from relegation then had an ok season following. His brand of football however was not enjoyed by the fans and there was a very vocal campaign to get him out. As much as I didn't agree with it at the time, it worked and he was sacked in favour of the fans choice John Sheridan. Even further back in history and an example of the opposite style of campaign - to stop Joe Royle leaving for a bigger job. The fans rallied and he stayed.
You may think that people are stupid for going along and paying money to get in, but in my opinion that buys their right to vote in a sense. What you do is take a position of 'protest' against Man Utd's owners then go down the pub and cheer on their success. That's a slightly less direct means of boosting their finances.
I won't defend people who boo players during the match, at HT and FT is slightly more acceptable but it's all in keeping with a pantomime society with heroes and villans and also a desire for instant gratification.
1b. One thing I'll say about the villification of Phil Neville is that the majority of England fans believe that he wouldn't have played so many games if he wasn't a Man Utd back up player. Does Gary Neville get stick for mistakes? More than any other player? As for Beckham, yes his treatment after 98 was appalling and unjustified but he knuckled down and turned it around. Did he sulk, ignore the media, leave the country, form a new club? No, he stayed and faced it and all credit to him for doing that. Tevez - well I may be paranoid but it's funny how it was an Argentine who draped himself in the flag. Not the French players, scots, irish, english, croat etc. It's not like he's the first Argentine to win a trophy in England either is it? Or that Argentina is a little country with little weight in the footballing world.
I'll stick the England thing in here... you keep making comparisons with England. How is Tevez wearing the Argentinian flag when accepting a club trophy in England the same as England fans displaying St George flags when supporting the team in the World Cup? How is my supporting Oldham and England the same as you supporting FCUM and MUFC? I've been to England matches home and away, does this automatically make me a burberry clad knuckle dragger? England has a section of idiot fans, as have Italy (Gucci clad), Holland, Germany, all South American countries and Rangers. These people are in the minority but you always refer to England fans as such. And who follows England because they don't like the success of their club team? England will never play against any club team. However, the same can't be said about FCUM and MUFC. Who will you support if they meet in the cup?
1c. opinions differ on this one so fair enough.
1d. I can't believe I forgot to include this first time round - the 2000 FA Cup. Absolutely disgusting that MUFC weren't in this. Whether they're own doing or that of the FA, they should have insisted on fielding a reserve team for one of the competitions.
2. I always find it so funny that Man Utd fans slag off Shearer so much. It could be Stuart Pearce, or Gazza who've thrown their weight about on the pitch and are loved by England fans. But no, it's Shearer. The guy who turned down Man Utd twice. I like him because he scored goals for England at the time that I've enjoyed watching them the most - Euro 96 mainly. I would never say he's a saint. I'll throw 2 words back at you though... Roy Keane. This is a guy who went on the pitch to deliberately attack another player. And this is self confessed. A flying studs high challenge to the knee - the guy should be in jail. And his reason for ending the career of a fellow professional?... He suggested Keane dived when he was actually injured. Yet Keano is a god to Man Utd fans so don't attack me for liking Shearer. And, in my opinion, you can't compare Shearer to Ronaldo either - he's not squeaky clean but he's no Ronaldo.
What gets me about this whole FCUM thing is that you're protesting against Glazer right? How? Chanting songs at some non league game? So what? What does that achieve? The German model of supporter ownership with safe standing areas in grounds is touted. And fair enough, I think it's a great model and would be great to have in the English game. But what are FCUM doing about it? If I felt so strongly about it that I stopped going to watch my team and had a few thousand like minded colleagues then I would suggest doing the following:
1. Protest outside Old Trafford and other football grounds
2. Gather support and signatures to lobby the FA to make it compulsory for all clubs to have a voting supporters rep on the board and a compulsory %age supporter ownership
3. Likewise for introducing standing areas
4. Organise in ground protests such as silences or stand up protests.
5. Form alliances with German FA and prepare documentary evidence of the benefits of the German model to present to government/FA.
6. Organise a mass cancellation of sky sports subscriptions.
Just a few ideas. How many of those or similar or other ideas are in action by FCUM? You've got a supporter base of a few thousand - more than enough to make a noise.
As far as I can see, FCUM is a bunch of fans who've set up their own team so they can get pissed up and go stand on terraces at tiny non league grounds and claim to be proper football fans because they go away to Droyslden and Chadderton. They want to enjoy the 'away day' benefits that lower league fans do. Yet, when MUFC are playing they go down the pub to shout for their TV team. It's a joke. Any lower/non league supporters who cheered on Utd/Arsenal/Chelsea/Liverpool from the armchair or pub stool would be berated and rightly so. Especially if they're then going and sticking 2 fingers up to fans of rival prem teams. One of the benefits of supporting a little team is that you are just that - a little team. It's a close knit community. Yet you're going down the pub and joining arms (metaphorically) with similar MUFC 'fans' around the globe.
ah, the debate rumbles on, jumping digital communication media as it does... i sense there are many points we'll never agree on, but...
first, sorry, i didn't mean to imply you (or all) england fans were burberry clad etc. We both know its not true, but many are. It was just a point of reference, akin to "all ManU fans are from surrey" etc.
i'm not saying that all those who go to a match when they're unhappy with the chairman/boss/performance/whatever is stupid. IT's their choice. However, it's also their choice if they want, not to go. That's the route that effectively FC fans have taken. Someone going is directly contribution; an FC fan watching MUFC on sky may be indirectly contributing - less than the man in the seat, I'd guess, by quite a margin? I'm not saying people shoudlnt' go, but why shouldn't they be able not to go? HAve you ever known anyone to grumpily buy a jar of marmite, slather it thickly on bread, eat it and go "i fucking hate marmite me boo, must remember to get some more next time i'm down the shops"?
RE tevez and his flag. I'd be surprised if the sports coverage in NZ showed all the extremities of the FA cup coverage so i'm guessing you won't have seen this, but at the end Kanu wore a "I love nigeria t-shirt" whilst doing his lap of honour (for example)
the argument about united and the cup in 2000 is tired. united were forced, off the back of the governments and FAs insistence, to go to that tournament and suggested we withdrew. We did. I agree, on face, you'd think they'd be able to throw together a ramshackle XI (of car park attendants if required). You and I will never know if they considered this or not, but maybe they did? Players have to be registered in advance for things. The world club thing would have required a large squad, management staff, coaching staff, physios etc.
And as for it showing united's disdain for the FA cup... many many ties for the last few years have been played by second eleven's in front of half-full stadium by teams more interested in securing mid-table obscurity than progressing in the cup. I think it says more about football's general disdain for the trophy.
Roy keane. Fair enough, a bad man. I'm yet to hear people calling for tommy smith, norman hunter and chopper harris to be jailed for the near-assaults they frequently admit to these days.
I also think that if Ronaldo played elsewhere (e.g. liverpool when they were initially interested in him) then he wouldn't be anywhere near as reviled as he is in a United shirt.
I also disagree that "proper" non-league fans don't cheer on other teams. Many will always cheer on MUFCs opposition for a start, we both know that. Aside from that though, I've seen it and spoken to many NL fans who have a team in both tiers, as it were and watch both. Some are more in favour of he prem team to the non-league team and vice-versa. WHy not? THey do both because they can. If they can't get to an away match and their non-league team is at home, why not watch them?
You say "us chanting in a nonleague match won't acheive anything". Much like AFC WImbledon haven't acheived anything? I've not seen MK Dons return back just yet, to use your criteria of acheivement. In fact they have acheived something: they've created a football club that they love and passionately support and enjoy, consolidated the history, culture and camararderie they enjoyed at WImbledon FC. IN the same way, that is the main thing that FCUM have acheived. In addition, every match they play is an acheivement. It shows Glazer, the world, whomever, that you don't have to do things their way.
ANd the reason why we metaphorically join arms with MUFC fans is that, well, we are MUFC fans. And that's MUFC not MUPLC Or Red Football limited.
The six measures you have there, FC United fans and various united supporters groups have done just those, or derivative of them. Unfortunately, there are large swathes of uniteds support who don't agree with us. Fair enough, their point of view, they're still united fans. That doesn't mean we can't have our own point of view.
1. It happened. It didn't work. It polarised opinion and created more damage than good for both sides
2,3 not done directly, but FCUM (and MUST, formerly IMUSA) have close links with Supporters Direct and bodies such as Stand Up Sit Down.
4. YOu mean pay into OT? Unlikely. Alternatively, set-up a team, get in a 2,000 crowd and organise an in ground protest that way?
5. Again, links with national supporters groups.
6. Done by many, not by all. See also budweiser, vodafone (at the time), Nike.
AS a matter of interest, what's your view on the other several thousand united fans who turned in their season tickets when glazer took over, but didn't come to FC? MAny of them exist and many of them watch UNited on the tv and are still united fans, they just don't put their coin direct in glazer's mitts. Do you have a problem with them?
And if not, then would you have a problem if they wanted to find something else to fill their saturday afternoon - preferably something football related, Manchester United related and doing it with a group of likeminded people? That's what FC UNited is. Its a vehicle for people to do that - watch a team that play in red and sing United songs and enjoy football. I can't see the problem. ANd if it doesn't acheive anything at the board room level of MUFC, then what's the problem? We're still enjoying ourselves and would do even if there were only 200 people doing it with me too. People go to FC United for different reasons. SOme due to direct disdain with Glazer's takeover. SOme with direct disdain for the way top-flight football as gone. Some because they just enjoy it, or because they can afford it. MOst do it for a mixture of those points.
IF MUFC and FCUM met in competitive football, I don't know what I'd do. Probably FCUM for the moral victory. THIs is a question that has raged amongst FCUM fans for a long time. Lots of FCUM fans have differing views and the important thing is, we respect each others views. EAch to their own, one member one vote.
AS for england never playing a club team... true, but what about days when England play on a saturday and their's a League 1 and League 2 program on? WOuld you actively frown on supporters of League 1/2 teams going to the england match?
And if you think FC is just an excuse for a thinly-vieled piss-up (which to a certain extent it is - but then isn't that true for many football supporters?), its worth checking out:
http://fc-utd.co.uk/karl.php
http://fc-utd.co.uk/fcunitedandmancat.php
http://fc-utd.co.uk/northerncare.php
etc
and particularly:
http://fc-utd.co.uk/manifesto.php
Yours,
A. Boring-Bastard
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